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[Lizbeth]

I do not understand this stuff. "padded sumo"?

Low lethality rate combats where both sides can afford to make tactical mistakes and take bad rolls and still it won't make them loose in the same round.

"dramatic flashbacks", if I am correct in the revealing of a characters past via flashbacks, is a literary device that does not work well in games because the characters cannot see the flashback (unless you create a way of showing memories to people around them), but works in stories because the audience can.

I mention dramatic flashback not as the "story about hero's past" (which is simple flashback). I mean stereotypical situation where protagonist is utterly defeated, lying on the ground with no strength to fight, then he experiences dramatic flashback and after that SUDDENLY burst in to fight with more strength, speed and skill than he had from the beginning of the combat.

this game tries to remain realistic while allowing an anime feel and storyline. The rules can be used to create nearly any anime idea

I'm very doubtful about the anime feel (however, actually I don't need it) — as I said before system itself do not support anime actions. This can be somehow alleviated by GM though.

Changing the setting and keeping the rules changes the game a lot. Removing the church, making the supernatural not hated...it would be interesting to see what would happen in a campaign without such restrictions in place.

Well, I have nothing against homebrew settings. But in the core setting there is Imperium.

Your check mate isn't.

Yes it is. Sure you can house rule this, but by rules they have to find tutor or appropriate books.

Who says that superheroics have no space for academic abilities?

They have space, they just have to find the tutor or appropriate books. And it's totally right from the game design point.

If there are physical superpowers, why can't there be academic superpowers?

Because then it'd be perfectly logical to use academics superpowers to make decisions with skills like analytics or psychology or such. I saw some games like "GM, my Int is over 9000, I roll it so you provide me with cunning plan".

[Kakugo76]

Sorry for bother you again, but where i could find the information about the mind control device of Imperium? i don't remember anything about it

[Lizbeth]

Sorry for bother you again, but where i could find the information about the mind control device of Imperium? i don't remember anything about it

Core Book p 251-2 Imperium Section.

[Kakugo76]

Thanks... maybe the Imperium erased that information from my mind...

[vytzka]

"Anime feel" is sort of a meaningless term because anime is not a genre. I would say Anima does Fist of the North Star rather well, for example (I have to admit I don't really have a very large reference pool for non-mecha anime). That it doesn't do Dragon Ball Z style craziness (well) is true but also sort of an excluded middle fallacy.

[Lizbeth]

"Anime feel" is sort of a meaningless term because anime is not a genre. I would say Anima does Fist of the North Star rather well, for example (I have to admit I don't really have a very large reference pool for non-mecha anime). That it doesn't do Dragon Ball Z style craziness (well) is true but also sort of an excluded middle fallacy.

Well, because of Anima is heavily combat-oriented I supposed it was pretty obvious that by anime I mean shounen anime.

[vytzka]

But DBZ, Fist of the North Star and Berserk are all "fighty" shounen (okay Berserk is seinen I guess? it's pretty violent) animes and yet they are rather distinct in the, well, nature of fighting.

Hell, taxonomies aside Avatar the Last Airbender is something people always bring up when I tell them about Anima. Even though I don't really watch the show but I can see the similarities with magic/ki techniques.

[Lizbeth]

Difference between DBZ and Berserk is mostly the level. Guts is Weaponsmaster of lv 7-10, while Goku is Technician of level 18 or more. Fight scenario patterns are quite similar (the mood however is different, Berserk is dark fantasy).
I don't know what is the Fist of the North Star (100+ episodes is way to much for me), and avatar.. I watched one episode, the whole combat stuff was dodging from ridiculously slow flames of some bad guy so he burned his own boats, the whole scene was quite retarded and reminded me of old X-Man series where lasers are slower than bullets and actually so slow that dodging them is not a problem at all. So I dropped it. Sure thing this stuff can be emulated with Dominion, but same goes to many other titles, and I suppose that was the point of the whole Techniques Creation stuff.

[vytzka]

There are Fist of the North Star movies, the first one is pretty great (that's all I watched anyway ).

And even if difference between DBZ and Berserk is level, that difference is extremely relevant for our purposes. I'm not really sure Anima is balanced for level 18 play, or that anyone actually plays that, even though the rules exist for such things.

But this is getting increasingly tangential I suppose.

[Spirit_Crusher]

I do not understand this stuff. "padded sumo"?

Low lethality rate combats where both sides can afford to make tactical mistakes and take bad rolls and still it won't make them loose in the same round.

"dramatic flashbacks", if I am correct in the revealing of a characters past via flashbacks, is a literary device that does not work well in games because the characters cannot see the flashback (unless you create a way of showing memories to people around them), but works in stories because the audience can.

I mention dramatic flashback not as the "story about hero's past" (which is simple flashback). I mean stereotypical situation where protagonist is utterly defeated, lying on the ground with no strength to fight, then he experiences dramatic flashback and after that SUDDENLY burst in to fight with more strength, speed and skill than he had from the beginning of the combat.

this game tries to remain realistic while allowing an anime feel and storyline. The rules can be used to create nearly any anime idea

I'm very doubtful about the anime feel (however, actually I don't need it) — as I said before system itself do not support anime actions. This can be somehow alleviated by GM though.

Changing the setting and keeping the rules changes the game a lot. Removing the church, making the supernatural not hated...it would be interesting to see what would happen in a campaign without such restrictions in place.

Well, I have nothing against homebrew settings. But in the core setting there is Imperium.

Your check mate isn't.

Yes it is. Sure you can house rule this, but by rules they have to find tutor or appropriate books.

Who says that superheroics have no space for academic abilities?

They have space, they just have to find the tutor or appropriate books. And it's totally right from the game design point.

If there are physical superpowers, why can't there be academic superpowers?

Because then it'd be perfectly logical to use academics superpowers to make decisions with skills like analytics or psychology or such. I saw some games like "GM, my Int is over 9000, I roll it so you provide me with cunning plan".

Above a certain level, tutors are impossible to find and you have to research "new" science, otherwise there never would have been advancement and all the science would originate from the original 440 science wielding tutor. Which is not. Your point defies itself.
As for the "gm you provide me with cunning plans (and\or revelations!)" is exactly how I gamemastered it in the past. The play shifts from devising plans to maybe executing them and most importantly facing the consequences.
One of the games I like most, Wild Talents, plays exactly like this. You get megasuperhuman skill in investigation? You are certain, often with no roll, of what happened when. Now, what do you do with the information? The game has a frantic pace which is very hard to adapt to when coming from more traditional gaming styles, but it can be very rewarding.
In anima you can make some characters that do similar stuff and you have two options: nerf them or change the style of gamplay accordingly. Obviously you can plan in advance and disallow certain character concepts for certain kinds of games\campaigns.

[FearlessElbow]

As for the "gm you provide me with cunning plans (and\or revelations!)" is exactly how I gamemastered it in the past. The play shifts from devising plans to maybe executing them and most importantly facing the consequences.
One of the games I like most, Wild Talents, plays exactly like this. You get megasuperhuman skill in investigation? You are certain, often with no roll, of what happened when. Now, what do you do with the information? The game has a frantic pace which is very hard to adapt to when coming from more traditional gaming styles, but it can be very rewarding.

Doesn't the game specifically give an example to GMs of providing the right words to use for an uncertain player who rolls well on Persuade?

It's just an extension of the same thing.

Maybe an extreme example (having the GM decide your strategy for you), but I doubt any of us are proficient enough in military strategy to know what to do with a good Tactics roll, so..... I guess it works there as well.

[Lizbeth]

Above a certain level, tutors are impossible to find and you have to research "new" science, otherwise there never would have been advancement and all the science would originate from the original 440 science wielding tutor. Which is not. Your point defies itself.

No it is not. Rules provide information on instaleveling, basically they tell you "no you cannot level up knowledge for no reason just because you have spare DP". Rules cannot describe anything, and actual research of something new were left out of scope. And well, it's rules, you either deal with them or house rule them.
Settingwise: Geniuses like Lucanor and Shwarzwald had to get their hands on Judas coin to start making all this wonders. Lost Loggias are coveted by all major powers not without reason. Basically introducing lasers is "who need the lost loggias? Just invent some DP".

One of the games I like most, Wild Talents, plays exactly like this. You get megasuperhuman skill in investigation? You are certain, often with no roll, of what happened when. Now, what do you do with the information?

Well, the roll had provided me with the best course of actions based on the God's (GM) own knowledge.

Doesn't the game specifically give an example to GMs of providing the right words to use for an uncertain player who rolls well on Persuade?

It's just an extension of the same thing.

Maybe an extreme example (having the GM decide your strategy for you), but I doubt any of us are proficient enough in military strategy to know what to do with a good Tactics roll, so..... I guess it works there as well.

It works only in the examples like tactics and not in superpower way. I doubt any GM would be very happy if the whole plot will be ruined by "I use my academic superpowers in analytics to figure the whole plot, where the true bbeg is and how to kill him in the most easy way".

[Spirit_Crusher]

 The rules provide guidelines and are left vague and bendable in places for purposes.
There are many hard rules in the game, but the leveling ones are quite vague. Changing caps on DP expenditure? Wreaks the game. All the rules on levelling though? They are suggested. For example, in no place in the book it is clearly stated what an inhuman or zen roll in intellectual skills can achieve, nor what a 15, or 18, or 20 in intelligence can do. So DECIDING THIS UNSTATED THING is not "changing the rules", it is filling blanks.
Anyway you did NOT reply my point of how advancement was achieved if anyone raising science or similar skills has to rely on someone knowing better than them.

[Lia Valenth]

Low lethality rate combats where both sides can afford to make tactical mistakes and take bad rolls and still it won't make them loose in the same round.

I mention dramatic flashback not as the "story about hero's past" (which is simple flashback). I mean stereotypical situation where protagonist is utterly defeated, lying on the ground with no strength to fight, then he experiences dramatic flashback and after that SUDDENLY burst in to fight with more strength, speed and skill than he had from the beginning of the combat.

1) "Low lethality rate combats" is not an anime thing, it is however a TV thing. Once again your confusing a literary device with something that needs to be explained by mechanics

2) You are correct and incorrect. Combining limits with abilities that only work at 1/4th HP could work exactly like this. However, once again that is a literary device, I do not know the official name for it but, http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StrongAsTheyNeedToBe will explain it.

As I said before, I do not believe that mechanics not being able to create literary devices can be a good reason for saying something 'cannot create the feel of anime'. But, then, obviously you are not a fan of anime, as that all you have noted is anime that was mainstream in America (which as pointed out isn't even a genre, but a style of artwork). Those of us that are fans have seen a lot more varied things that what has been mainstream in America, in example HunterXHunter was a shounen anime, extremely popular in japan, and very deadly. A fight would take 20~30 seconds and someone would die by the end of the fight. Interestingly it was so violent and deadly that they are now making a lighter and softer version for kids.

Important Note: Please read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNS_Theory, while it may or may not be accurate, it is a good way to explain the difference of opinion here. Depending on if you are a Gamist, Narrativist or Simulationist your opinion on the reason for rules, and therefore execution of rules varies greatly.


And, Spirit_crusher,

For example, in no place in the book it is clearly stated what an inhuman or zen roll in intellectual skills can achieve, nor what a 15, or 18, or 20 in intelligence can do. So DECIDING THIS UNSTATED THING is not "changing the rules", it is filling blanks.

     You are correct here, as well on your gaining higher skill in Science. However I still do not see any being, no matter how intelligent or skilled at science, of being able to make the leap from extremely simple projectile weapon to plans for fully functional lasers. Now they may come up with some interesting things, and with the help of a Forger getting Zen rolls they might be able to make Lasers in 20 or 30 years of research.
     But, if you want this to be an ability you are correct that it is not 'against the rules' so much as 'ruins my suspension of disbelief'. I just cannot believe such a thing could happen even in a High Fantasy game. So I would make rules that would make this take at least a few decades.

[Spirit_Crusher]

     But, if you want this to be an ability you are correct that it is not 'against the rules' so much as 'ruins my suspension of disbelief'. I just cannot believe such a thing could happen even in a High Fantasy game. So I would make rules that would make this take at least a few decades.

Yeah, that I can understand and relate to.
Good call on the big model anyway. I don't find it 100% accurate but it is a good read.