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[Lizbeth]

give 'em Gnosis 15

Open rolls on doubles? Isn't that an overkill?

[FearlessElbow]

Point taken, but I suppose you don't always KNOW when you start off how long the campaign is going to last.

You might plan on topping out at Level 10 when you start out, but then find that you and the players are invested in the characters and this version of Gaia, and it just keeps going.

I suppose as GM though you could just houserule them all a Gnosis-shift at that point.  Don't even need to tell them, since it's not a big enough shift that they start picking out Gnosis-granted supernatural powers. A bit like not telling them if their Élan goes up and down.

[Sharpandpointies]

give 'em Gnosis 15

Open rolls on doubles? Isn't that an overkill?

Meh, at worst I just say 'congrats, you're all gnosis 15' without giving them the open rolls on doubles.  Or whatever.  

And it's no worse than allowing people to start at 10 and gain +1 gnosis per level, or other stuff like that.  They're going to hit that point anyway.

Point taken, but I suppose you don't always KNOW when you start off how long the campaign is going to last.

You might plan on topping out at Level 10 when you start out, but then find that you and the players are invested in the characters and this version of Gaia, and it just keeps going.

Then you just say 'hey, congratulations!  You guys might 'only' be gnosis 10, but thanks to tireless hard work and so forth you've managed to THWART FATE (or whatever) and actually make a big difference'.  

The big thing about having high gnosis is that the world swirls around YOU, whether or not you try.

Gnosis 10 is big enough that serious crap can happen to people, and if they then work their rears off to get involved, they might just make a serious difference.  Most of the 'name level' characters in Anima ARE gnosis 10.

[FearlessElbow]

I must admit I didn't realise that about the named characters (except for guys like Elisabetta, who are explicitly stated to have crazy-high Gnosis for a human).

That feels... comforting, somehow.

[Lizbeth]

And it's no worse than allowing people to start at 10 and gain +1 gnosis per level, or other stuff like that.  They're going to hit that point anyway.

You see, base Gnosis 15 means Natura +15 which is open roll on doubles and 6 destiny dices. Base Gnosis 10 + 1 per level is Natura 10 anytime. Same way as Using spells like Chimera won't increase Natura while increasing Gnosis.

Point taken, but I suppose you don't always KNOW when you start off how long the campaign is going to last.

You might plan on topping out at Level 10 when you start out, but then find that you and the players are invested in the characters and this version of Gaia, and it just keeps going.

I suppose as GM though you could just houserule them all a Gnosis-shift at that point.  Don't even need to tell them, since it's not a big enough shift that they start picking out Gnosis-granted supernatural powers. A bit like not telling them if their Élan goes up and down.

First of all, it's told that GM can change Gnosis of the PC to whatever values he sees fit.
Second, maximum Gnosis for a human is 20 which means immense importance. And it still won't allow to buy monster powers.

[Sharpandpointies]

And it's no worse than allowing people to start at 10 and gain +1 gnosis per level, or other stuff like that.  They're going to hit that point anyway.

You see, base Gnosis 15 means Natura +15 which is open roll on doubles and 6 destiny dices. Base Gnosis 10 + 1 per level is Natura 10 anytime. Same way as Using spells like Chimera won't increase Natura while increasing Gnosis.

Chimera messes everything up, essentially making someone into a Gnosis 25 creature. 

Basically, the whole Gnosis/Natura for people under 25 is an artificial construct GM's use whether they want to or no.  One could just as easily kick the whole thing from the game without it suffering in the least.  It's not going to make a huge difference on the game if Elisabetta suddenly doesn't inspire normal people to get open rolls.  That sort of thing is plot thingamagiggery anyway.

Basically, for points under 25, it's either:

1.  An excuse to give players funky open roll bonuses (Natura 15 or higher);
2.  An excuse for why the players always get embroiled in these things, and why they seem to shoot up levels really quickly when normal people...don't.

25 or higher, monster powers and high magic start kicking in, so yeah, at that point it's kind of a measure of how supernatural something is and has solid, constant game effects rather than optional stuff like funky open roll rules. 

I pretty much ignore it, myself, except to say "okay, Elisabetta has a 20 Gnosis, so crap tends to happen around her a lot."

[Sharpandpointies]

I must admit I didn't realise that about the named characters (except for guys like Elisabetta, who are explicitly stated to have crazy-high Gnosis for a human).

That feels... comforting, somehow.

I'm sure Kisidan and other ultra-high-level people (and probably Gaul) have Naturae running around at 15.  But then, they had all kinds of wacky stuff happen to them. 

[Lia Valenth]

give 'em Gnosis 15

Open rolls on doubles? Isn't that an overkill?

I sorry but Gnosis 15 does not give you anything, unless your using Natura rules, but that is an Optional rule. So, give em Gnosis 15 and ignore Natura. Problem solved.

[Lizbeth]

Chimera messes everything up, essentially making someone into a Gnosis 25 creature.

Not in this case. It won't mess with Natura.

It's not going to make a huge difference on the game if Elisabetta suddenly doesn't inspire normal people to get open rolls.

Well, I'd say that Elisabetta is one of the worst npcs. Her Mary Sueish stuff like being chosen, The One and other like this risks to turn game in to "watch how special she is".

1.  An excuse to give players funky open roll bonuses (Natura 15 or higher);
2.  An excuse for why the players always get embroiled in these things, and why they seem to shoot up levels really quickly when normal people...don't.

Also it's excuse to have more than one open roll and to have some weird events to happen around you. 

[vytzka]

Well, I'd say that Elisabetta is one of the worst npcs. Her Mary Sueish stuff like being chosen, The One and other like this risks to turn game in to "watch how special she is".

She still has a lot of work to do before she catches up with Lucanor

[Lizbeth]

She still has a lot of work to do before she catches up with Lucanor

At least Lucanor isn't supposed to surpass Kisidan's rear-kicking abilities.

[vytzka]

She could maybe do that some day if someone doesn't cap her sorry level 7 ass in the meantime.

Lucanor is too awesome for you to handle RIGHT NOW and can probably build a mech to beat Kisidan anyway if he took some time off being super awesome and I dunno banging all the hawt Wissenschaft chicks or playing with his panther or whatever.

(not a euphemism. Maybe.)

[Lizbeth]

She could maybe do that some day if someone doesn't cap her sorry level 7 ass in the meantime.

She is soo chosen that her sorry Lv 7 arse is totally safe from any NPC who wish to kick it. Lucanor tried to kidnap her once — suddenly le wild Nemesis appeared and mauled Crows around the Gaia.
Ah, and she is Pal 7 at her age, which is around 18. And she possess every-technician-dream-about-it sword. And what a coincidence, Kisidan is also a tech. We all can see where it's going. Lucanor is Lv 16 so we can expect some Pal 7 Tech 9 star. Always dreamt about it.

Lucanor is too awesome for you to handle RIGHT NOW and can probably build a mech to beat Kisidan anyway if he took some time off being super awesome and I dunno banging all the hawt Wissenschaft chicks or playing with his panther or whatever.

(not a euphemism. Maybe.)

Daaku is on the Kisidan level of power, yes.
However as for now the strongest gear they have is Legacy. But he have crazy overpowered Daaku thing which can kick arses up to the orbit. He need no mechs or fine ladies.

[Spirit_Crusher]

In my game 3 pcs out of 4 have natura 15. The fourth has natura 20.

The ones with 15 are: the (partially conscious) reincarnation of Demeter Stratos, working for Lucanor as he sees the new Rah in him;
 the reincarnation of the right-hand man of Ghestalt Noah Orbatos, almost his equal in power, which wields his own soul as a sword and
 the reincarnation of the only Ebudan hero to personally stand against Noah when his race was cast from the heavens, one of his wings ripped from his body. His tattoo has the "strongest kempo in the universe" written in, created by one of his previous reincarnations.

The one with natura 20 is messenger zero, the messiah of destruction.
In "my" setting, I have 4 other characters with natura 20: Elisabetta, Lucanor, Faust Orbatos and Romeo.

[Lizbeth]

In my game 3 pcs out of 4 have natura 15. The fourth has natura 20.

The ones with 15 are: the (partially conscious) reincarnation of Demeter Stratos, working for Lucanor as he sees the new Rah in him;
 the reincarnation of the right-hand man of Ghestalt Noah Orbatos, almost his equal in power, which wields his own soul as a sword and
 the reincarnation of the only Ebudan hero to personally stand against Noah when his race was cast from the heavens, one of his wings ripped from his body. His tattoo has the "strongest kempo in the universe" written in, created by one of his previous reincarnations.

The one with natura 20 is messenger zero, the messiah of destruction.
In "my" setting, I have 4 other characters with natura 20: Elisabetta, Lucanor, Faust Orbatos and Romeo.

That's quite a heavy HOUSERULEd Gaia.

I doubt I want to erase setting so as for me lower values in general are fine.